Curse

Painbringer · Aug 13, 2007, 03:20 PM // 15:20

I am a heavy PVE player. I have in the past soloed with heroes against the Z Elite Squad to get faction to buy skills. This weekend instead of standing around and grabbing presents in Factions I thought I would try the PVP side a little. Since I have read so many rants and raves about skill balances it beckoned me to check it out. I went to RA in Ascalon Arena to try out my new level 8 Mesmer. Played well and balanced until I ran into non native born characters and nasty Level 20 pets with level 9 masters. Obliviously it is some sort of an exploit. Do the Faction and Nightfall classes have an advantage? Do they have max armor? My question is why would A-net let this happen? They worry so much about balance and people playing PVP. Why would they not nip it? I would think it would be pretty easy for them to fix. Disable the charm pet skill if the pet is above Level 10 or force the pet to the same level as owner. Armor question I am really not for sure maybe someone can verify if they have Max armor and if so A-net could drop and balance it when you enter the battle. My point to this post is this is the beginning Noobville for PVP where characters get there first chance to try it out pretty much for the first time. If you walk in and get spanked every time you try it because of exploits you will lose interest in a hurry.

For you flamers about to type you suck so now you write a post about it. After numerous attempts I changed characters and left the beginning area. I went to RA on the battle isles and had a great time earning mounds of faction with my level 20 characters. My post is just an observation.

Thanks

Pain

myword · Aug 13, 2007, 04:40 PM // 16:40

ascalon arena? i completely forgot about its existence, ANet probably has too

Frank Dudenstein · Aug 13, 2007, 05:16 PM // 17:16

Thinking that Ascalon Arena has anything to do with PvP balance is like thinking that Vietnamese twinkie consumption has something to do with our war plans in Iraq (um, wait, bad example...)

PvP balance revolves around GvG and HA. Occasionally TA/HB/RA are taken into consideration. Ascalon Arena is not on the radar, the map, the globe, or the star chart. I think it is in a black hole somewhere in the constellation Lyra...

If you want to learn why some skills are overpowered ... you pretty much have to see them in a cohesive 8v8 build run by an experienced team. (and no just because you beat that r2+ ritspike pug doesn't mean it was balanced...)

Pae · Aug 13, 2007, 05:41 PM // 17:41

I'd say to just not bother with non-high level PvP, especially with the introduction of skill tomes. You'll also have people who get run places to get max armor or death level pets for every cheap advantage that they can get; it's not worth bothering with it, even if you do go against some people who want a fair competition to actually test their skills, people who are afraid of a real challenge will still be there.

Painbringer · Aug 13, 2007, 07:11 PM // 19:11

You are correct I did just that left and went somewhere else. Skill tomes can be offset by the lack of attribute points. But going against a group that has a Paragon and a Dervish with full armor mixed with level 20 pets (yes 2 of them) it is NO contest at all. In fact one player was pretty much AFK while his pet did all the work. As a beginner to GW you would start there because you have no access to the battle isles. Then be destroyed over and over. After a while you would say to yourself I suck at this. Why should I waste anymore time at it? And another full time PVE only player is born. I just don’t think that is A-nets intention and should be addressed.

Deleet · Aug 13, 2007, 08:03 PM // 20:03

Anets dont give a shit about non-20 pvp combet, and they are correct. Complete waste of time. Get to level 20 or better, use a pvp character.

Voltar · Aug 13, 2007, 11:19 PM // 23:19

Ascalon Arena...That's the one where everybody runs their character to Drok's for max armor and max weapons and elite skills (and has for the last year and a haf); isn't it?

I find it hard to believe those people would tame a lvl20 pet and use it there. That arena is the pillar of integrity.

Chrono Re delle Ere · Aug 13, 2007, 11:35 PM // 23:35

Well tis is interesting lol. I thought that ascalon arena got closed duh

Well I remember when I took poison arrow (there was not still the thing "unlock a skill in pvp, get it anywhere in pve") and used it in ascalon arena....everybody got pwned xD Well, rly, even if someone palys his first pvp match in ascalon arena they will just think "I'm not max lvl". So there is no point into worring about it :P Anyway it's a nice consideration^^

pork soldier · Aug 14, 2007, 01:42 AM // 01:42

HowTo get a level 20 pet at level 8:

get nub armor, fill it up with sup/major runes to drop your health as low as possible

get a couple of heroes with a hard res, rebirth is gud, a mesmer with rebirth is better. also equip a res signet.

disable all of the skills on the heros bar except rebirth, set hero to "run away from red dots"

trade in current pet, identify new target pet

go find pet, kill everything around it, put on your low hp/al armor, put away any +hp weapons or offhands. punch pet

let pet eat you, watch hero res you, let pet eat you, watch hero res you, repeat ad nauseum or until pet is level 20.

disable rebirth, enable res sig, enable any healing the hero has to spam at you. res, swap armor as fast as you can and go to +hp weapon set, start charming new level 20 pet.

have fun.

longhornrob · Aug 14, 2007, 06:00 AM // 06:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by pork soldier

go find pet, kill everything around it, put on your low hp/al armor, put away any +hp weapons or offhands. punch pet

let pet eat you, watch hero res you, let pet eat you, watch hero res you, repeat ad nauseum or until pet is level 20.

I found that part to be the most entertaining.

CyberNigma · Aug 14, 2007, 09:04 AM // 09:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by Frank Dudenstein

Thinking that Ascalon Arena has anything to do with PvP balance is like thinking that Vietnamese twinkie consumption has something to do with our war plans in Iraq (um, wait, bad example...)

PvP balance revolves around GvG and HA. Occasionally TA/HB/RA are taken into consideration. Ascalon Arena is not on the radar, the map, the globe, or the star chart. I think it is in a black hole somewhere in the constellation Lyra...

If you want to learn why some skills are overpowered ... you pretty much have to see them in a cohesive 8v8 build run by an experienced team. (and no just because you beat that r2+ ritspike pug doesn't mean it was balanced...)

heh yeah that one threw me off too. I thought this thread was some kind of comparison between GW/PvP and real twitch-based PvP or deep strategy PvP (aka chess).

Painbringer · Aug 14, 2007, 02:24 PM // 14:24

To death level pet you can also lure one to a rez shine and let it kill you for hours solo. Then let them kill you remove all armor and weapons to speed up the death or use a -50 off hand to speed it up. It is a way to try and get an aggressive / dire pet. But since there is a level cap of 10 at this arena. Why should they let level 20 pets in? I know I am making a mountain out of a mole hill but this is the place to let a-net know it is happening. Maybe I am a real “Harper” or something and strive for balance.

Xanthar · Aug 14, 2007, 03:07 PM // 15:07

Let's just write off the Ascalon/Shiverpeaks arenas, shall we? The amount of coding required to get these arenas to be a fun experience for new players is daunting in comparison to whatever PvP incentive they might serve as. The correct way to fix them is to close them permanently.

The current situation where new players are getting baldy beaten by griefers just drives potential PvP recruits away from that part of the game.

Pae · Aug 14, 2007, 06:13 PM // 18:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by Painbringer

It is a way to try and get an aggressive / dire pet.

From what I understand, pets can't/don't evolve, if they aren't already charmed. What determines a pet's evolution is also based off of how much damage the owner deals/takes.

Stormlord Alex · Aug 14, 2007, 06:57 PM // 18:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pae

From what I understand, pets can't/don't evolve, if they aren't already charmed.

Nope. Death-levelling a pet from 5 to 20 makes it Dire.
I know... I do it a lot 'cuz Dire = ftw.

WarKaster · Aug 14, 2007, 08:10 PM // 20:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stormlord Alex

Nope. Death-levelling a pet from 5 to 20 makes it Dire.
I know... I do it a lot 'cuz Dire = ftw.

QFT

All my pets are Dire from the White Tiger on my Dervish to the Warthog on my Warrior.

Xenex Xclame · Aug 14, 2007, 09:57 PM // 21:57

You can't use elite skills in low lvl arenas anymore.
You can however use max armor and max weapon , if you meet the req for the weapon is another story.

================================================== =======

The reason why low level arena suck so much is because the game was not balanced for pvp around the concept of being lvl 8, it was all balanced around everyone being lvl 20.

I suggest you indeed try with pvp chars if you want to get the feeling of PvP , but unless you find somehow to do GvG or Ha , you will not get the real experience.

In my opinion RA Is worse then AB , so i would suggest to try stuff out in AB but then again this is also flawed.

For me real GW pvp has to have some criteria s.

1) It must require you to have a Res in order to be effective.
In other words, any type of pvp that a res is not needed is not reall pvp.

2)It must require you to have some kind of healing.This either by having monks healing you or that you have to bring healing skills in order to survive,So what i mean is, it must be where the way to win is not just brute force.

3) You must be worried about dieing.Lets take AB as an example, what are the consequences of dieing?Not really much, maybe you lose the shrine you were capping but you res in 10 seconds anyways.

In any high end PvP, you will suffer a Death Penalty , that will hurt and you either have to get ressed by someone ( maybe even waste a sig) or wait till you get autoressed. ( which in GvG can take 2 minutes)

4) It must require humans. ( Do i have to explain?)

So in that sense:
RA:

1)If you don't bring a res ,you might have just cost your team the game.

2)Because of how RA works you can not think about a monk healing you, so you have to do it yourself otherwise , you will die pretty fast.

3)In RA you are worried of dieing because again , it can cost your team the game ,who know maybe you even get 3 other people that none brought a res.You are also worried that because if you die you will be weakened meaning , you have to do more in order to survive and you must also be careful of not dieing again

AB:

1) Brining a res here when your allies will res in 10 seconds anyways is seen as a waste because,there is no penalty for dieing , sure your ally might have to run all the way back from base , but that is probably the worse thing.

2)Because here yo do get to make your team, you can make a team build if you are gonna stick together,which would mean a monk might come in handy,which then equals you can worry a little bit less about healing and think about more damage/utility.

3)In Ab you don't really care if you die or not ( of course you don't WANT to die) Like i said above , if you do die then the worse thing that might happened is that you start all the way back at base and have to run a long distance.

I personally don't like RA because its Random,but it being random it does make you think more about your build,I cant bring all damage skills, what if i don't get a monk, or what if i am blinded all the time while i am playing a warrior, so all these things have to be taken into account when making your own build.

But then theres the part where GW isn't about your build, its about your teams build, your build is just part of a bigger one.

So that where AB comes in, if you where to do it right, you would make somewhat of a team build, ok monk heals war kills, mesmer takes care of casters and Ranger crip shots the target so the war can get to them.

So after that long post , I think i come to the suggestion of trying them all out go Ra/AB/TA/Ha/GvG and then you can get a better picture of GW pvp.

Hope it helped

Pae · Aug 14, 2007, 11:09 PM // 23:09

Ah, nice to know Stormlord. I'll have to go edit wherever I read that the next time that I see it then.